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2015-04-03 Popping Sound Lifting to Centerstand

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Posted 03 April 2015 - 08:33 PM

Almost every time I put KrZy8 on center stand, right at top of lift, a very loud popping sound. Energy bound, released. Sent forks and shock for rebuild at GP Suspension. They found 'the worst worn cartridges we've seen'.

 

Installed newly serviced forks/shock. POP remains.

 

How loud you ask? Clearly audible even with ear plugs in.

Sounds like from the triple tree. Kind of. Hard to tell. 

 

Took KrZy8 to local dealer for advice. Of course, KrZy8 would NOT perform. No POP. fuck.gif

 

With front end airborne, no looseness in triple tree. Travel, stop to stop, is smooth. 

 

Upper tree clamping bolt nice and tight. 

 

Soo then, when all else fails, tear it all down and look. 

 

About 6 years ago I replaced the stock steering head bearings with tapered rollers, Timken. Not the shitty All Balls. 

 

I haven't seen the lower race yet, but the upper race was not as lubed as I would hope. All surfaces were dry, but not pitted or galled. Still, shiny. 

 

Of course, being me, I did not remove things like the front wheel before removing the upper triple.. not so smart, but I recovered.

 

Now then, where from here? I was able to re-clamp the upper tree, remove the tire, calipers, etc..

 

Tomorrow - fork removal then triple tree inspection. 

 

Question - last time, used Mobil 'red' grease. This time, thinking of using NeverSieze. Any comments pro or con?

 

Question - has the collective decided upon on torque value for tapered roller bearings?

 

Question - anyone else experienced similar 'POPPING' sound when lifting to center stand?

    Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
    I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
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    #2 Twigg

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    Posted 03 April 2015 - 08:49 PM

    Just an off-the-wall query .... Could it be the center stand spring catching, then jumping?

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    #3 escapefjrtist

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    Posted 03 April 2015 - 09:44 PM

    Question - last time, used Mobil 'red' grease. This time, thinking of using NeverSieze. Any comments pro or con?

     

    Question - has the collective decided upon on torque value for tapered roller bearings?

     

    Question - anyone else experienced similar 'POPPING' sound when lifting to center stand?

    DC, I'd use a quality disc brake grease to repack the Timkens, no way in hell use anti-seize for bearings, it's not meant for that. Do a quick search for Timken bearing installation and you'll get the correct procedure for setting them.

     

    I've got Timkens in my '09 and never experienced any popping as you've described.

     

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    #4 bluesdog

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    Posted 03 April 2015 - 09:48 PM

    *
    POPULAR

    It's your vertebrae

     

    (I think Twigg may be onto something.  The center stand spring is actually two springs, one inside the other.)

    Science is about unanswered questions
     
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    #5 dcarver

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    Posted 04 April 2015 - 08:41 AM

    I forgot to mention I cleaned and lubed the center stand pivot points and springs.

      Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
      I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
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      #6 escapefjrtist

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      Posted 04 April 2015 - 08:30 PM

      So what did today's inspection[s] yield?

       

      --G

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      #7 dcarver

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      Posted 06 April 2015 - 08:05 PM

      --G

       

      Cleaned and lubed, re-tourqed Timken steering head bearings. 

       

      Still POPs LOUDLY like something is freaking in the process of breaking.

        Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
        I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
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        #8 bluesdog

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        Posted 06 April 2015 - 08:09 PM

        Do you have a safe, secure means of raising and supporting the bike so you can check the action of the center stand?

        Science is about unanswered questions
         
        Religion is about unquestioned answers

        #9 HotRodZilla

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        Posted 06 April 2015 - 09:08 PM

        Carver, you gotta narrow it down. What's popping? The centerstand?? Is it coming from somewhere else, can you tell? The only thing that moves when you put the bike on the stand is the stand itself and the front tire, just a little bit.

        I'm betting on a jammed up spring somewhere. No bolts have backed out underneath? Maybe getting hung up on something. 

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        #10 bluesdog

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        Posted 06 April 2015 - 09:26 PM

        ^ yep, I agree with AJ.  That's why you need to isolate the probable source:  the center stand

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        #11 supertankerm60a3

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        Posted 06 April 2015 - 10:05 PM

        I would recommend, after safely securing the bike in an upright postion, remove the spring and check the relaxed center stand for play and looseness.  I am thinking you will find a significant amount.  Time for a new one, or just ignore it for a year or so.


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        #12 exskibum

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        Posted 06 April 2015 - 10:43 PM

        Following this with bated breath until the answer is identified. (And to see how much other, gratuitous maintenance Don can get done before finding the answer). ;)
        Forum Guideline 2 ("No religious/moral philosophy/political crap.") as arbitrarily applied when all posters are in compliance: "I'll go ahead and lock this one down ahead of time . . . ." (guess who :rolleyes:)

        #13 dcarver

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        Posted 08 April 2015 - 09:40 AM

        AJ, it sounds like the top right of the fork area, near the battery. I know that sound can travel from the true source to a place closest to your ear.

         

        Will attempt it on a lift with jack underneath and check the c-stand.

          Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
          I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
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          #14 Geezer

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          Posted 08 April 2015 - 04:21 PM

          If it might be coming from just below the fork then take a look and verify that you have the large plastic rivet that goes under the nose in the center. I had that come out and the cowling would catch on the big plastic 'steering cover' that is attached to  the triple tree. 

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          #15 dcarver

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          Posted 13 April 2015 - 09:38 AM

          Update - pretty much confirmed it's not the center stand. If I dismount making sure to not allow the forks to extend, put it on side stand, I can get it to pop by lifting up on the right handlebar. Sometimes it pops twice. A little pop followed by the big pop. It's loud. If you heard it person you'd most likely say WTF! 

           

          I'll keep looking - and Geezer I'll look for loose stuff under the triples and and for the big plastic rivet. Not exactly sure what it is you speak of, but will look for it...

            Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
            I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
            Posted Image

            #16 exskibum

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            Posted 13 April 2015 - 10:21 AM

            Is it something inside a fork tube, Don? Do you have a stethoscope you can tape to a fork tube while you do your magic creating the pop? 

            Sounds like you've isolated it to the front end and it's not the triple trees, steering head or bearings. You know as well as I what's inside the fork tubes and I think we both have the GP Suspension upgrades there. Have you somehow worn or broken a spacer or washer or the delrin spring guide bushing they inserted so that a fork spring is catching and then unloading when the front is unloaded to create some space inside? Are the cartridges securely affixed and torqued in the lower legs? 

            Damn baffling, but like Ray says - you put some stress on motorcycle parts and do break shit. ;-p 
            Forum Guideline 2 ("No religious/moral philosophy/political crap.") as arbitrarily applied when all posters are in compliance: "I'll go ahead and lock this one down ahead of time . . . ." (guess who :rolleyes:)

            #17 dcarver

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            Posted 13 April 2015 - 01:33 PM

            Is it something inside a fork tube, Don? Do you have a stethoscope you can tape to a fork tube while you do your magic creating the pop?

            Sounds like you've isolated it to the front end and it's not the triple trees, steering head or bearings. You know as well as I what's inside the fork tubes and I think we both have the GP Suspension upgrades there. Have you somehow worn or broken a spacer or washer or the delrin spring guide bushing they inserted so that a fork spring is catching and then unloading when the front is unloaded to create some space inside? Are the cartridges securely affixed and torqued in the lower legs?

            Damn baffling, but like Ray says - you put some stress on motorcycle parts and do break shit. ;-p

             

            Good idea for the stethoscope. I would hope it's not in the front forks, just had GP completely rework them.. I will be changing rear tire soon, will check linkage down there too.. sound can carry really well through aluminum..

              Walked away Posted ImagePosted Image Is it really crashing if you don't fall down?--
              I wouldn't change a fucking thing; I've lived hard, played hard, and I ain't done yet. I've paid some severe penalties along the way, but the rewards have been so much greater; even if for just have participating in the game of life with utmost abandon. It's not who rides the furthest in a day, but rather in a lifetime. CBA member #1, IBA #31845 and very proud of both.
              Posted Image

              #18 Steve in Phx

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              Posted 13 April 2015 - 03:56 PM

              It's your vertebrae

               

              LOL!  That got me laughing.  :)

               

              Maybe it would be helpful to setup a video camera and record it from both the left and right sides.  You could replay the video in slow motion and identify the exact point in the process when the POP occurs.

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              #19 RossKean

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              Posted 13 April 2015 - 05:30 PM

              You just had the forks reworked? How long after did the noise start?

              If VERY recent, I'm betting on something amiss inside the fork. 

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              #20 HotRodZilla

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              Posted 13 April 2015 - 08:20 PM

              Right, what Ross said. What do you mean by "recently worked on?" Does that mean you reinstalled them and a week later you started getting this noise? I would be HIGHLY suspicious of the shock's internals. 

              "To every man upon this earth death cometh soon or late.
              And how can man die better than facing fearful odds,
              For the ashes of his fathers,and the temples of his Gods"
              ---Horatius

              "If you can't contribute to the post don't bother posting, keep your smart ass comments to yourself !!!"

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              SOLVED??!

              Popping identified as originating here - at the frame slider / engine mount. Loosened the clamp, loosened the slider/engine mount bolt, removed the inner collar, applied anti-seize to all, re-torqued using a calibrated right wrist-wrench, tightened pinch bolt..  Rode and lifted with lowers off, no POP. Installed lowers, did a half-dozen lifts, no POP. Now I can clearly hear the centerstand creak, it needs a full service.. but that's another thread. 

              In a few moments will be off for a longer test ride, let the engine and frame come up to full temperature then lift and listen for POP. My unscientific guess is that this area may have had captured energy due to thermal positive coefficient of growth. Applying vertical force allowed the bound energy to POP in order to relax to a normal condition. 

               

               

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